Heating query.

[Mad4slalom]

Hi all, anyone on here with a garage with heating ? Wondering how many rads I would need to heat a 26’ x 15’ x8’. Aprox 3400 cu ft garage. ?
TiA

 

[stealthyflatfish]

It is an exact science if you have a heating calculator, ( I don't ) it would depend on the construction of the room, single brick walls or cavity walls with brick on the inside. Or cavity walls with brick outside and thermal blocks on the inside, is the cavity filled with insulation ? Have you got any windows, single or double glazed. Floor construction solid or wood on joists as you see many factors come in to play. But I'll show you the way I used to do it and never had an issue.
For the UK market 26 x 15 x 8 x 5 divided by 3414 = 4.56kw Now you don't really want one big rad on the wall, your better off spreading the heat source around, so with that in mind you would require two rads giving out 4.56kw output.

 

[Mad4slalom]

It is an exact science if you have a heating calculator, ( I don't ) it would depend on the construction of the room, single brick walls or cavity walls with brick on the inside. Or cavity walls with brick outside and thermal blocks on the inside, is the cavity filled with insulation ? Have you got any windows, single or double glazed. Floor construction solid or wood on joists as you see many factors come in to play. But I'll show you the way I used to do it and never had an issue.
For the UK market 26 x 15 x 8 x 5 divided by 3414 = 4.56kw Now you don't really want one big rad on the wall, your better off spreading the heat source around, so with that in mind you would require two rads giving out 4.56kw output.

Thanks SFF 4.5 kw each or in total.? Its is only one end of the big shed. Construction is unconventional so hard to compare to a regulation build.
the first metre will be single block, then 2”of celotex , then waterproof breathable membrane then the 6x1” timber boards.
above one metre it will be 4” of celotex, WB membrane then the timber boards.
on the inside of the celotex will be 18mm stirling board.
I have four , 1200 x 600 double rads for downstairs and another four fo the upstairs mez room of the same size. The floor/ceiling between the upper and lower rooms is wood joists and chipboard flooring and will have rockwool in between. There will be a deviding wall between both the upper and lower rooms with block to 1 metre then studwork but with two large DG picture windows in the bottom wall providing a view into the corvette area. From the rest of the shed. I dont expect insulation values of anything like a proper home, but as long as it is dry and warm enough to keep the vette protected so I dont need put it in an airchamber.
I have bought a nr new worcester greenstar heatslave 12/15 heat only boiler and oil tank and hope this will be enough to run these rads.
any other thoughts or ideas welvome

 

[Mad4slalom]

Thanks SFF 4.5 kw each or in total.? Its is only one end of the big shed. Construction is unconventional so hard to compare to a regulation build.
the first metre will be single block, then 2”of celotex , then waterproof breathable membrane then the 6x1” timber boards.
above one metre it will be 4” of celotex, WB membrane then the timber boards.
on the inside of the celotex will be 18mm stirling board.
I have four , 1200 x 600 double rads for downstairs and another four fo the upstairs mez room of the same size. The floor/ceiling between the upper and lower rooms is wood joists and chipboard flooring and will have rockwool in between. There will be a deviding wall between both the upper and lower rooms with block to 1 metre then studwork but with two large DG picture windows in the bottom wall providing a view into the corvette area. From the rest of the shed. I dont expect insulation values of anything like a proper home, but as long as it is dry and warm enough to keep the vette protected so I dont need put it in an airchamber.
I have bought a nr new worcester greenstar heatslave 12/15 heat only boiler and oil tank and hope this will be enough to run these rads.
any other thoughts or ideas welvome

 

[stealthyflatfish]

4.56 kWh total for room. or 15600 btu's in old money, this is just an approximation and should get you in the. ball park. Now don't get the hump I'll just try and explain with my thoughts, heat input requirement is dependent on room size construction and u values, a garage is not classed as a habitable room so this is were it becomes a bit of a guessing game for me. I'm assuming the 8 rads you've got already came as a job lot and heat calculations where not carried out on each room ? Your boiler size depends on your total heat input into the house, so with the eight rads you have, and you haven't stated wether the rads you have are just double panels or double panels with convectors and the additional heat input for the garage, that's an input of approximately 58000 btu's or 17.22 kwh, so your boiler will be slightly undersized. In conclusion will it work
Yes but it might take a long time to get up to temperature ( 21deg c ) if it gets there at all. good luck.

 

[Mad4slalom]

4.56 kWh total for room. or 15600 btu's in old money, this is just an approximation and should get you in the. ball park. Now don't get the hump I'll just try and explain with my thoughts, heat input requirement is dependent on room size construction and u values, a garage is not classed as a habitable room so this is were it becomes a bit of a guessing game for me. I'm assuming the 8 rads you've got already came as a job lot and heat calculations where not carried out on each room ? Your boiler size depends on your total heat input into the house, so with the eight rads you have, and you haven't stated wether the rads you have are just double panels or double panels with convectors and the additional heat input for the garage, that's an input of approximately 58000 btu's or 17.22 kwh, so your boiler will be slightly undersized. In conclusion will it work
Yes but it might take a long time to get up to temperature ( 21deg c ) if it gets there at all. good luck.

Hmmmthanks for this info stealthy, I had started to wonder whether , after buying various rads from FB marketplace if the boiler would handle them all I will add up the btu output of them and adjust accordingly. It was a bit un thought through as I had the chance of a I year old boiler, with tank and flue for £350 so ran with it without really planning things ahead. I am hoping it will be warm enough to work on the vette in some comfort and to keep the car from deteriorating in a cold damp room. When I built my beach buggy I spent many months late at night in a draughty and very cold garage til the early hours so should be a fair bit better than that

 

[Roscobbc]

The level of heat required for the cars 'best health' and to minimise condensation forming on the vehicles really only needs to be a few degrees above ambient and over freezing point - not the same as a 'comfortable' temperture for the human body. It is too late to consider from form of heating in the floor screed, electric or perhaps using your boiler. An electric system could be low temperature and for 'personal' comfort when working in there simply use a butane or oil space heater - even electric wall or ceiling heaters?

 

[FIVE RED]

An ideal set up would be a rad on each side & another at the end, if you think your boiler can cope with it. Keep in mind you aren't heating a living room, just keeping the chill off the garage so no condensation forms on the Vette.
Some years ago I bought a 1200x500 rad from Screwfix & tee'd it into the house heating system. Our boiler came with the house so I'm guessing it was the smallest the builder could get away with at the time. The rad gets hot & keeps the garage at a comfortable temperature for doing any work. I recently added a heating coil to the pond filter (that's another story) & even that doesn't make any difference to the house system. While making the connections during December the garage rad was isolated & the garage was really cold, so obviously the garage rad was making a difference.
To sum up - any rad will make a difference.

 

[Mr. Cricket]

4 wall mounted radiators is a lot of lost wall space! Is it too late to consider a wall mounted split air conditioning heat pump and then you free up all that space and get cooling and dehumidification in the deal as well? Could be set to provide frost protection in the background then you can ramp it up when you're working in there.

Toshiba 5.4kw unit with our discount is £800 (to CCCUK members only )

 

[Mad4slalom]

An ideal set up would be a rad on each side & another at the end, if you think your boiler can cope with it. Keep in mind you aren't heating a living room, just keeping the chill off the garage so no condensation forms on the Vette.
Some years ago I bought a 1200x500 rad from Screwfix & tee'd it into the house heating system. Our boiler came with the house so I'm guessing it was the smallest the builder could get away with at the time. The rad gets hot & keeps the garage at a comfortable temperature for doing any work. I recently added a heating coil to the pond filter (that's another story) & even that doesn't make any difference to the house system. While making the connections during December the garage rad was isolated & the garage was really cold, so obviously the garage rad was making a difference.
To sum up - any rad will make a difference.

Yes , I am sure some will be better than none. I find any calor type heating produces a lot of moisture and I find head achey and anything electric , enough to make much difference would be very pricey, so I think oil is the best way to go.

 

[Roscobbc]

4 wall mounted radiators is a lot of lost wall space! Is it too late to consider a wall mounted split air conditioning heat pump and then you free up all that space and get cooling and dehumidification in the deal as well? Could be set to provide frost protection in the background then you can ramp it up when you're working in there.

Toshiba 5.4kw unit with our discount is £800 (to CCCUK members only )

Have you had success with heat pumps? - curious to know of professional experience.

 

[Mr. Cricket]

A little bit yes Ross. Been doing it since 1981..

 

[Mad4slalom]

4 wall mounted radiators is a lot of lost wall space! Is it too late to consider a wall mounted split air conditioning heat pump and then you free up all that space and get cooling and dehumidification in the deal as well? Could be set to provide frost protection in the background then you can ramp it up when you're working in there.

Toshiba 5.4kw unit with our discount is £800 (to CCCUK members only )

Hmm n

 

[Mad4slalom]

So not an air source heat pump as such ?but an air conditioning unit ?
Runs on electric so must be expensive ? Or not as bad as I think ? I have bought almost all the bits now for the oil fired system. I will do some googling tho, thanks

 

[Roscobbc]

A little bit yes Ross. Been doing it since 1981..

Sorry - the question came over all wrong - no one local seems either to know the answers (or doesn't want to tell me) - the reason I asked is that my existing gas fired central heating to radiators combi is probably going to need replacement at some point......I wanted to do this before government planned ban (if indeed it will now ever happen) - or.......consider an air source heat pump.
The three things that concern me are -
1. cost of unit
2. need perhaps to replace existing rads and pipework with new underfloor system due to lower operating temperatures -
3. and now with sharply increasing energy costs whether a pump will actually cost more to run than a new condensing gas fired combi.

 

[Mr. Cricket]

Feel free to give me a call Ross, Mad numbers in the mag. Not trying to sell anything, we don't do domestics and we're too busy anyway.

 

[johng]

Ross, I've got an air source heat pump and am happy to discuss if you want.

 

[Roscobbc]

Ross, I've got an air source heat pump and am happy to discuss if you want.

Speak at next club night?

 

[johng]

Sounds good to me