Hello, just joined, looking for a C5 or C6.

[JetJock]

Thanks JR
A Tech 2 is a unit to access the computers in the car? Like OBD?
You are based in the USA?
In the UK, I would need to take it to a GM dealer?
Or, buy or borrow a Tech 2?
Thanks again for your input. It's nice to get a few of the "what ifs" sorted before purchasing a car. With a 20 year old car there will be plenty of "known unknowns" but I'm trying to cut down the number of "unknown unknowns" that are associated with buying a car I only really started learning about recently.

 

[teamzr1]

Your Welcome JetJock,

Yes, I am in Texas of the USA
A Tech-II is an electronic tool used by Techs at GM repair shops used only for GM vehicles and has the ability of doing diagnostics
and to flash in calibrations of controllers

People other than GM dealers may own a Tech-II for a repair shop but not be fully updated to support all GM vehicles
When a vehicle owner changes tire type, rear end gear ratio changes or wheel/tire size the vehicle that may need changes via a Tech-II
to inform the controllers of the changes so that it reports the MPH correctly to command the correct auto tranny gear shifts by MPH

If only wanting to increase the maximum MPH allowed, not all dealers would do that since the new speed is higher than rated tire
and may refuse to make that change, so you either need a friendly tech who is willing to make the change

Or use someone like me that does custom tuning changes to the PCM and auto tranny controllers

 

[teamzr1]

Corvettes since the C5 came with a Z rated tire and as I show here for a C6 Corvette max speed would be 185 MPH

IF you could find the specs of a jap spec Corvette and also came with Z rated then should also be same speed rating
Unless that country dictates low speed max be set in the calibrations

Guess you need to do a pre-sale test run and see what the max speed is

 

[JetJock]

Thanks for your patient and informative responses, JR.

It's all a little academic, for most of the time. "most" that is... hehehe

It will definitely be a manual box, so I only need to programme my own hard-wired computer for the gearshifts - although that might take a little while, as it's possibly the equivalent of a very early iteration of Windows...

And just to dot the Ts and cross my eyes:
1 - Do you / can you sell the Tech II?
2 - Can a moderately competent welder, but utter technophobe, do the necessary with it, and, if not, can I get you to do it online or something?

And, before anybody begins to suspect that we're conspiring to commit a felony (not sure how we grade it in the UK, but I'm pretty sure people caught doing those kinds of speeds on the highway lose more than their licence), I did say above that I may take the car onto a race track eventually and it would be nice to be able to give an answer hand on heart to the old question "What'll it do, mister?"

 

[Stingray]

A number of used buyers in UK aspire to own a manual C5/C6 but the fact is they're scarce creatures. About two thirds of all Corvettes, including in UK, are bought with the auto box. For practical purposes, given that Corvettes are scarce in UK in the first place, manual cars on the used market are few and far between - so if you want a manual you can forget choosing a colour! And then you encounter the problem of owners who say they want to sell but ask silly prices.

As regards OBD, Tech 2 and so forth any "garage" with comprehensive diagnostic equipment should be able to read codes and sort things out on a Corvette. However, not all independents have the right gear let alone the skill/inclination to get to grips with car they've not seen before. In many cases it's best to find someone familiar with GM Americans, which itself takes you into a world of uncertainty.

I've owned modern Corvettes for nearly 25 years and it's never been an easy ride. Even consumables like tyres and batteries can be a challenge, never mind the fancy stuff.

If you want a relaxed ownership experience there's something to be said for buying an unmolested car and having it looked after by the UK official dealer. And there are no slow Corvettes so don't fret too much about what the top speed might or might not be.

 

[teamzr1]

A number of used buyers in UK aspire to own a manual C5/C6 but the fact is they're scarce creatures. About two thirds of all Corvettes, including in UK, are bought with the auto box. For practical purposes, given that Corvettes are scarce in UK in the first place, manual cars on the used market are few and far between - so if you want a manual you can forget choosing a colour! And then you encounter the problem of owners who say they want to sell but ask silly prices.

As regards OBD, Tech 2 and so forth any "garage" with comprehensive diagnostic equipment should be able to read codes and sort things out on a Corvette. However, not all independents have the right gear let alone the skill/inclination to get to grips with car they've not seen before. In many cases it's best to find someone familiar with GM Americans, which itself takes you into a world of uncertainty.

I've owned modern Corvettes for nearly 25 years and it's never been an easy ride. Even consumables like tyres and batteries can be a challenge, never mind the fancy stuff.

If you want a relaxed ownership experience there's something to be said for buying an unmolested car and having it looked after by the UK official dealer. And there are no slow Corvettes so don't fret too much about what the top speed might or might not be.

Stingray is there a good reason people in the UK do not want a manual tranny ?

I know Corvette guys here in the USA that will not buy a C8 because there is no option for a manual tranny

In 50 years of owning like 10 Corvettes has one been an auto tranny, as my left leg would not know what to do with itself

 

[JetJock]

Thank you too, Stingray.
I am a bit concerned about the lack of support in the north of Scotland, but I think that may apply to whatever I get. Porsche 928s are 2 or 3 times the price, TVRs are just way too "out there" and lack support up here, and all Jaaags are autos.
I'm hoping the Corvette's reputation for good reliability is my ace in the hole. I haven't asked yet, but a local garage does or did prepare rally cars; they're pretty supportive in general and I'm hoping they'll be able to read up, even if I have to pay them to do so, maybe.
Equally, I may have to bite the bullet and drive the thing back down to England (or, worst case, trailer it!) for serious work. And I'd be keen to get it fully serviced / checked before driving it north.
Any recommendations for garage service anywhere near the (not so) frozen north will be appreciated.
Thanks again.

 

[teamzr1]

Thanks for your patient and informative responses, JR.

It's all a little academic, for most of the time. "most" that is... hehehe

It will definitely be a manual box, so I only need to programme my own hard-wired computer for the gearshifts - although that might take a little while, as it's possibly the equivalent of a very early iteration of Windows...

And just to dot the Ts and cross my eyes:
1 - Do you / can you sell the Tech II?
2 - Can a moderately competent welder, but utter technophobe, do the necessary with it, and, if not, can I get you to do it online or something?

And, before anybody begins to suspect that we're conspiring to commit a felony (not sure how we grade it in the UK, but I'm pretty sure people caught doing those kinds of speeds on the highway lose more than their licence), I did say above that I may take the car onto a race track eventually and it would be nice to be able to give an answer hand on heart to the old question "What'll it do, mister?"

Glad to hear your a racer using the Corvette as designed and not a waxer

If buying a Corvette that has an auto tranny it is common for guys to swap out the auto and rid that shifter to convert to manual and
I can tune the controller to now know a manual is being used.
Like this C6 and the calibration in the PCM


No, I do not sell a Tech-II because it is not something you buy and that is it
To make it fully useful, the owner then has to buy a monthly or yearly costs to GM to be able to connect their Tech-II
and have it download from GM updates, controllers in vehicles calibrations, fixes as to TSB, etc

What my business since 1995 is custom tuning that entails the engine, tranny, rear end gear size and changes as to tire and/or wheel size changes
95% of my customers are not local to me, they are worldwide, and I do this tuning all via internet emails as the GM vehicle owner need 2 electronic tools to make this happen and 95 % of the time the owners do not even know very well how to use a laptop but even then I can walk them through the simple process of what I need to cook up a custom tune for them, and they use a tool to flash it into their PCM

So yes, even a welder can learn how to use the tools of today

We do the speeds here in the USA on public roads which is called "Open Road Race" (ORR)
80 to 120 miles of a public road is rented and shut down to the public, and then we go and haul ass.

Go Fast or . . . . Go Home

 

[Stingray]

Stingray is there a good reason people in the UK do not want a manual tranny ?

I don't think there's any difference in mix of manual/auto between UK and other markets. Pretty much two thirds of all Corvettes always seem to have been sold as auto.

Sure, auto boxes were slower to catch on generally in Europe than in North America and I think that's down to the combination of weedy 4-pots (back in the day), significant additional cost (back in the day) and additional risk of problems (back in the day). I'm reminded of a US market Ford Escort I rented a long time ago - so gutless that unless you were on the throttle the engine would stall if the power steering was turned to full lock with the A/C running!

Any Corvette is a rare creature in UK so manuals are particularly scarce.

So if UK owners are "enthusiasts" why aren't there more manuals over here? I think it's a combination of factors including,
* Auto can be seen as part of the American car ownership experience,
* Auto boxes partner well with big V8s,
* Brits don't have to learn to change gear with the other hand, and
* Avoids skip-shift which we know some manual owners choose to defeat in any event.

 

[teamzr1]

Too much of a hassle trying to get clear numbers, let say of C5s having which tranny
But here is total count of C5s made as to coupe, ragtop and hardtop (Z06), total around 250,000 C5s

Of course, if buying a C5 Z06 only came with the MN6

I would think if looking for performance, the MN6 (manual) would weigh less than A4 and also the weight of the torque convertor
Also, the MN6 had the better 3.42 rear end gear

 

[JetJock]

And thank you once again, both.
If I end up with the Japanese car, then I'll ask you to do the online whizzo stuff, JR. Having one of these limited to 112 mph (the actual Japanese restriction on all cars sold there, I have now found), would be like riding a thoroughbred racehorse with one leg missing, in my view. Not that I ride horses.
Off to view 3 cars over the next couple of days: 2 x C6, 1 x C5, all manual, and no doubt, all with "issues" that I'll need to investigate. The highest miler is 60,000, but with used cars, it will only have taken one idiot to thrash it ignorantly for a 1,000 miles and the damage is done. We shall see. Or not... :O
Any recommendations for southern garages for a service after purchase would be greatly appreciated. Wish me luck.

 

[stealthyflatfish]

And thank you once again, both.
If I end up with the Japanese car, then I'll ask you to do the online whizzo stuff, JR. Having one of these limited to 112 mph (the actual Japanese restriction on all cars sold there, I have now found), would be like riding a thoroughbred racehorse with one leg missing, in my view. Not that I ride horses.
Off to view 3 cars over the next couple of days: 2 x C6, 1 x C5, all manual, and no doubt, all with "issues" that I'll need to investigate. The highest miler is 60,000, but with used cars, it will only have taken one idiot to thrash it ignorantly for a 1,000 miles and the damage is done. We shall see. Or not... :O
Any recommendations for southern garages for a service after purchase would be greatly appreciated. Wish me luck.

AAS in Newcastle upon Tyne, two minutes off A1 before you head back over the border, their bread and butter are exhausts and service but work on yanks and Corvettes all the time, lots of our northeast members take their Vetts there and they come highly recommended, worth a phone call ? Good luck.

 

[JetJock]

Spot on. Thank you very much Stealth.

 

[Stingray]

Too much of a hassle trying to get clear numbers, let say of C5s having which tranny
But here is total count of C5s made as to coupe, ragtop and hardtop (Z06), total around 250,000 C5s

Yes, and where you end up is that in very round numbers about one third of Vettes are convertibles and about one third of all Vettes are manuals. So anyone in UK looking for, say, a manual convertible would need to approach their search with determination. Add a preferred colour choice and it'll take a while to find any cars to look at!

I suspect UK buyers who decide not to be too fussy about specification get a much easier ride by following the traditional used car priorities of,
* Overall condition,
* Service history,
and finally
* Price.

 

[teamzr1]

And thank you once again, both.
If I end up with the Japanese car, then I'll ask you to do the online whizzo stuff, JR. Having one of these limited to 112 mph (the actual Japanese restriction on all cars sold there, I have now found), would be like riding a thoroughbred racehorse with one leg missing, in my view. Not that I ride horses.
Off to view 3 cars over the next couple of days: 2 x C6, 1 x C5, all manual, and no doubt, all with "issues" that I'll need to investigate. The highest miler is 60,000, but with used cars, it will only have taken one idiot to thrash it ignorantly for a 1,000 miles and the damage is done. We shall see. Or not... :O
Any recommendations for southern garages for a service after purchase would be greatly appreciated. Wish me luck.

You may want to consider getting a OBD-II scanner/recorder
This one below works via Bluetooth and has software to work on a cellphone and a laptop

OBDLINK MX+ Scanner

This would allow not only seeing ant error codes in the car but also all the engine and auto tranny and allows while driving to
record all that data and is saved to be later replayed to be analyzed or even emailing it to me and I can fully analyze and report what
I see.
GM engines and manual trannies are bullets, I know several guys with C5 or C6s that have around 250,000 miles on them, and they still run well

You also might consider not knowing how well the car was treated to right off the bat do some minor up keeping like

1. Clean the Mass Air Flow (MAF) and throttlebody.
2. Replace the air filter
2. replace the sparkplugs.
3. If not knowing what maintenance was done is replace the tranny and rear end fluids
4. Pour some decarb cleaner in engine oil and gas tank
5. Via the DIC off dash check for any error codes (DTC) or use the above scanner for a full error check)
6. If you tell me what year you bought, I can attach a GM engineering PDF that will have all the techie detail of the design
7. And if knowing the VIN # I could tell you what GM TSB (fixes) software updates were done

 

[JetJock]

I'm pretty keen to drop it off on the way home, very likely at the facility suggested above, for a service. And now I have the makings of a list for them to work through. Thanks again.

Another thought I just had is that the likeliest one needs an MOT (annual regulatory required check), and when they do that (at the seller's expense), I'd ask them to do a full laser wheel alignment (at my expense) with a view to finding out (I hope) if the chassis is bent from a prang. My last chance to sacrifice my deposit and walk (run) away.

The C5 I will look at has had the leaf springs replaced with coilovers, which is one of a few factors that make me very wary of this one. I'm inclined to wonder why do people muck in such a radical way with suspensions that were designed at vast expense in the first place to do the job right? But, since writing that sentence, I've googled and found that there are perceived benefits, including the possibility for a softer street ride, as well as improved track performance - the latter being a warning, perhaps...

But, as Stingray mentioned above, condition and history are all. I start to find out, tomorrow.

 

[teamzr1]

Corvettes are designed to stand up to racing so as long as past owner did not abuse it, then car should be fine
Good pluses to going coilovers
I would not do the alignment first until you decide on a shop that can do 4 corner height adjustments and only then do the 4 wheel alignment as
the height adjustment will change the car's stance and screwup if alignment is done first

1. reduces total weight of car
2. reduces unsprung weight, which is good for racing
3. allows easy way to make suspension changes as different track or drivestyle
4. Allows for 4 corner height changes
5. Allows for moving the center of gravity
Here is an example of me doing coilovers on 1994 C4 ZR-1
C4 Coilover Project

Let you adjust like this :



I would check if the past owner changed both sway bars and if from GM came with the active handling package

 

[JetJock]

Thank you.

Noted, your advice to delay the tracking check. I do recall now that the Knowledge books I've armed myself with detail a quite complicated procedure for this. I'll do my best to check for signs of chassis / body damage / repair.

Against the track benefits, I should balance whether the insurance company might refuse cover or charge a premium for a modified car.

In general, I suspect that, for a noob like me, t'would be simpler and safer to get something closer to standard, especially given that the seller doesn't know the manufacturer of the coils, so it might be quite difficult to establish just what the heck's been fiddled with under there.

 

[FIVE RED]

Re the suspension - one of our North East members had a C5 & put coil overs on, but he knew his way around a car so was very experienced. He was pleased with the results but his driving style could be described as 'enthusiastic'.
My 02 C5 has the Z51 'Sports Suspension Package' as a factory option, thicker sway bars etc. The ride is firm but that's to be expected from such a car, it's still a comfortable ride though. The worst thing I did was fit a brand of tyre when the Pirelli's were at an age when they needed to be replaced. They were recommended but although the car handles well & they show minimal wear, the noise is horrible on some road surfaces though.

 

[JetJock]

My search was short and sweet, and is now at an end. I was very lucky that 3 manual cars were all available in the south (well, including Yorkshire, which is south, for us up here in Scotland) just when I was required to visit the area for my 6 monthly simulator check ride.

I'd have preferred marginally one of the black ones - don't want the car to stand out in my local area any more than necessary, and I think they do look great in black. I never got to visit the black Japanese import C6 manual which is on Auto Trader, with about 40,000 miles, in Walthamstow. It looks fabulous in the pictures.

I drove a red 05 C6 with good history, in great shape, last owner 5 years who was regretfully selling to fund his new business venture selling quality cars. I never forget you are buying from a person, at least as much as looking at a car, and Marc is a very genuine guy with a love of quality cars and doing things right. It's a pleasure doing business with, and making the acquaintance of, the guys at Autospire of Knaresborough.

I also drove a 98 C5 with lowered diff and a misfiring V8 (priced accordingly) that nevertheless pulled like a train (it was running fine when I drove it).

I loved both the ones I drove, but the higher price and good history for the 60,000 mile manual, black over red, C6 was worth it, and I must now wait patiently until I return from working overseas to pick it up in a month's time. Purchase price in the low 20s, if you'd like to know.

This will give me a chance to do more reading, including my copy of Sports Car and Competition Driving by Paul Frere, and investigate options for in car driving instruction in due course.

Thank you all very much indeed for your guidance and advice - all of which is most welcome, and more of which will be equally welcome and appreciated in the future, if you are so kind. I look forward to meeting up with you if possible.

What a BRUTAL BEAUTY!